Badass Therapists Building Practices That Thrive
Welcome to Badass Therapists Building Practices That Thrive, the ultimate resource for mental health professionals ready to step into their power, grow their practices, and create a career they love. I'm Dr. Kate Walker, a Texas LPC/LMFT Supervisor, author, and business strategist who's here to show you the path to success.
Formerly Texas Counselors Creating Badass Businesses, we’ve rebranded because, well, we’re way too big for Texas now! This community of badass therapists is growing nationwide, and we’re here to help you create a career and practice you love, no matter where you are.
Every week, you'll get practical advice, proven strategies, and motivation to help you build a thriving practice—one that gives you the freedom to live your life on your terms. From mastering marketing to designing scalable systems and becoming a clinical supervisor, this podcast is your roadmap to leveling up without burnout.
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Badass Therapists Building Practices That Thrive
154 Navigating Difficult Conversations with Clinical Supervisors: A Guide for Pre-Licensed Therapists
When supervision goes sideways, what's a pre-licensed therapist to do? In this candid conversation, Dr. Kate Walker and Jennifer Marie Fairchild pull back the curtain on one of the most anxiety-producing challenges facing associates and interns—addressing problematic supervision.
Many therapists-in-training find themselves frozen when faced with supervision red flags, trapped between speaking up and risking their relationship with someone who holds power over their career. This episode offers practical, actionable strategies for having these difficult conversations with confidence and professionalism.
We tackle the supervision power dynamic head-on, reminding associates that while these strategies empower you to advocate for yourself, the ultimate responsibility for a healthy supervision relationship lies with the supervisor. Learn how to document concerns, use "I" statements effectively, leverage your knowledge of state regulations, and bring solutions rather than just problems to the table.
Perhaps most importantly, we address the boundary-setting that sometimes becomes necessary in problematic supervision relationships. From networking resources to supervision directories, we outline concrete options for associates who may need to transition to new supervision. The mental health field desperately needs dedicated new professionals—you're too important to lose because of discouraging supervision experiences.
Whether you're currently experiencing supervision challenges or simply preparing yourself for potential future difficulties, this episode provides the roadmap and reassurance needed to navigate these waters with professionalism and self-advocacy. Remember that pushing back and developing your professional identity is a normal part of clinical development, not insubordination—and most supervisors genuinely want to support your growth when approached thoughtfully.
Ready to transform your supervision experience? Listen now to gain the confidence to address concerns, set healthy boundaries, and continue your journey toward full licensure with renewed clarity and purpose.
Get your step by step guide to private practice. Because you are too important to lose to not knowing the rules, going broke, burning out, and giving up. #counselorsdontquit.
there. Good, hey, I'm Dr Kate Walker. This is Jennifer Marie Fairchild, and we are going to talk about having hard, tough conversations and we're going to relate it to. In fact, it's not even related to. It's exactly for LPC associates or pre-licensed folks, anybody who is under supervision, if they are having some difficulty with their supervisor.
Speaker 1:So last time, jennifer and I pulled back the curtain on the warning signs of toxic supervision. Maybe as you listened you thought, uh-oh, I've seen some of those. Spotting the red flags is the first step, but the next step, and the one that takes real courage, is figuring out how to speak up without tanking your relationship or your career. Put a pin in that. I'm going to come back to that. That's exactly where we're headed today how to address difficult supervision situations in a way that's confident, professional and safe for you and your clients. Now you could tell I was reading that and I wanted to come back to that point about tanking the relationship and tanking your career.
Speaker 1:Here's what you have to understand supervisees, interns, anybody under supervision in a clinical setting. The relationship is your supervisor's responsibility. We teach the 40-hour training to become a supervisor. We teach supervisors about the importance of creating a safe space for you supervisees. So the things Jennifer and I are going to talk about today, I want to make it really clear. I'm going to use Jennifer's word we're empowering you. We are not putting the obligation on you to fix something that's broken, right, this is you sensing? Okay, I think there's some red flags. I've got to do something. I've got to address this because, jennifer, too often, you know, we see usually in the interwebs, right, we see threads from supervisees who are just kind of frozen, right, I mean, they don't know what to do.
Speaker 2:No, they feel completely at a loss. For how do I navigate this? Because the supervisor is supposed to be the expert and they're supposed to know everything and you're, you know, just a lowly supervisee. What do you know? Right? And? And trying to come to your supervisor and address an issue can be incredibly intimidating. I mean, I see, I see posts all the time of supervisors who've made this beautiful Canva and it's advertising all of their services and they're looking for associates. But they say now, accepting new LPCAs, yeah, and you just sit there and you want to go. You know, polite reminder, there is no LPCA license.
Speaker 1:But even then you're like I don't want to make them mad, Right, so, and for those of you who aren't, in Texas, lpca is not a recognized definition, abbreviation of anything right, it's got to be LPC associate. And if your supervisor doesn't even know that and they put that in an advertisement, you know anyway red flags, an advertisement, you know anyway red flags. So we're trying to empower you. If you're listening to this and you're in a situation where you are frozen, you are. You know, fight, flight, fear, fawn. You know. You're in a position where you're just not feeling empowered to do anything or you're in a situation so this is kind of a funny thing In Texas you do not have to be employed at the same site as your supervisor.
Speaker 1:Jennifer, you're in New Hampshire and the law is different, right? You're as a pre-licensed or provisionally licensed person there, you have to work at the same place as your supervisor. So in Texas, if you happen to be working at the same site as your supervisor or you're employed by your supervisor, having this tough conversation takes on a whole different meaning, because you may be afraid for your job, for your income.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and that is a real fear and I've talked to other people and everything's great until it's not and you can hold your breath and truck along and just keep your fingers crossed. But the reality is is we're all people with our own ideas and concepts and you're eventually going to, in some capacity, clash as far as beliefs and how things are supposed to go. And if you work at the same site that your clinical supervision is taking place, it's like I'm not just telling my clinical supervisor, I disagree with them. Now I'm telling my boss who cuts my paycheck.
Speaker 1:Yes, my boss who cuts my paycheck? Yes, and supervisees. As I mentioned, we teach this course and one of the things we really try to drill down and get into our new supervisors' heads is the idea that conflict is normative, like that's part of your development. You're supposed to push back on your supervisor. You're supposed to develop your own identity, you're supposed to develop your own way of doing therapy. And if your supervisor senses that as insubordination, or you know you're talking back or you know we see that a lot too. Right, when we're grading these papers and we're looking at all these, you know the feedback and the contracts and the plans and supervisors don't. And they learn, believe me, they learn from us and supervisors that come out of the other end of our course and they've got their certificate. They understand that pushback is normal and they're prepared to handle these conversations, but not every supervisor is. And they're prepared to handle these conversations, but not every supervisor is.
Speaker 1:So I've got a list over here and I'm going to go through how to be assertive not aggressive, but to be assertive and bring topics up with your supervisor. That may be difficult, so let me scroll, scroll, scroll, all right. Number one get clear on the issue first. So if you notice a pattern starting to happen, one of the things we talked about in the last episode was if your supervisor is unavailable, that's a huge red flag. It goes against the laws in most states for licensure, for supervision. It's just not a good situation If you sense things like that starting to happen, document the dates, examples and the impact on clients or your work. So when you have this conversation you can stay fact-based, so handing the evidence to the supervisor. Jennifer, which one do you want to talk about?
Speaker 2:So I love because in your 40-hour course we touch a lot on the rules and the laws and the board requirements and I mean we have a lot of people that come into the course and they'll admittedly say I wasn't familiar with this. I've had people send an email and say where do I go to find BHEC rules? And glad you're here because we're going to give you that information.
Speaker 1:We wrap our arms around them and show them the way. Yeah.
Speaker 2:But I feel like by the time they leave your course they have a pretty healthy understanding of where to find the rules. They don't have to memorize all of them, they don't need to know 681.41 is blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But I encourage associates and interns to know these things too, because you can't argue with it Right and, in my interpretation, or my opinion, because I heard somebody years ago tell me something doesn't hold up to the actual law. And, as an associate, if you're familiar with your state's laws, if you're familiar with the difference between you know ACA code of ethics as a guideline versus what is actual law in your state, that's powerful information and you can always go to your supervisor and say, hey, this is the rule, can we talk about it?
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, and coincidentally, that is actually one of the rules for LPC and LMFT in Texas for supervisors. You guys are supposed to be reading through the rules and when we do get privy to complaints and that happens when I'm asked to consult on cases and one of the things that I'll see is oh, you know, they broke this rule. And then they go through your notes and there's no evidence that you ever talked about the rule. So this documentation, this idea of evidence, supervisees. I want you to take your own notes in every supervision session so that when you do come with an issue, you've got the facts. Okay, using I statements. That's just good counseling, right?
Speaker 1:I notice, I feel when this happened, I felt, right that less of an accusatory tone. Right, don't come in with guns blazing. And that's something you would tell your client, right? You would tell them. Okay, if you're trying to have a conversation, you need to make sure that you're coming from a space of I. If you do couple counseling, what I hear you saying is when I hear that I feel All of that still works in a situation with someone that you're trying to have a difficult conversation with. But again, I'm going to just keep telling you it is. I just keep telling you it is. I'm telling you how to approach, but I'm not telling you that fixing this is your, is your obligation. This is, this is something where you're just you're saying, hey, look, the tires flat, but it's up to the supervisor to call the tow truck and change the tire. Ok, jennifer, any comments on that? I hope I'm saying that right.
Speaker 2:No, that was perfect To that point like you talk about, like it's not your job to refill the tires, just to notice. We're human and a lot of people haven't worked through stuff and they have a defensive reaction. And so if you go to your supervisor and you're like, hey, I feel like this or I noticed this, and your supervisor reacts defensively, it's not your job to help your supervisor walk through that. It's not your responsibility to fix their reaction. You can't control their reaction. It's going to happen. You get to decide. Where am I going to go with this? What do I want out of this? You brought it to the table, not I going to go with this. What do I want out of this? You brought it to the table, not your job to control their response.
Speaker 1:Yes, I love that. Yeah, and so I'm going to. This just came to my mind and I want to piggyback on that, because what we teach this brings up remediation. Okay, so let's say that your supervisor sits you down and says you know what? You're getting a remediation plan today and you're like whoa, is it? Because it's Tuesday, like where did this come from?
Speaker 1:And you don't have time to listen to this podcast and look through all the things, right? I want you to keep in mind that, for remediation, best practices, unless you've done something egregious, right? If your supervisor just caught you having sex with the client, well, forget about it. You know what Remediate out of here. Don't ever counsel again. But I'm talking about if you're in a situation where your supervisor surprises you with some sort of a negative critique, evaluation, remediation, something like that. As you're listening and you're trying to manage your own reaction, right, just like Jennifer's talking about. You know that's hard to do. I want you to keep in mind and think ask yourself have I been evaluated? Did I ever see a supervision contract? Was I ever taken through an orientation? Right? One of the things we teach at Kate Walker Training is an OER triad, which is an orientation, then regular evaluations before remediation, and so once you get out of that supervision and you have a chance to take a breath, sit down, write this down and say wait a second, I was never given a contract or I was never given an orientation, or I've never been evaluated right. I know lots of supervisors out there who still don't regularly evaluate their supervisee.
Speaker 1:And then when something does happen because maybe your supervisor's on to something, maybe you are doing crappy notes, maybe you still don't know how to reflect and extend, and your supervisor has their own difficulties with a difficult conversation so out of the blue, they're going to be okay. I got to fix this today when they really should have brought it up the second or third week. You guys were working together, right? So this brings me to the next thing, which is bring solutions, not just problems, right? So after you've had a chance to breathe, you've listened to this, you've written some things down and you ask your supervisor hey, can we talk about this negative interaction that we had? Here's what I'm noticing, here's what I think should have happened and here's what I propose. I would really love to be taught the skill of reflecting and extending meaning in a conversation. I would really love the art of silence. I would really like to learn how to do this cognitive behavioral worksheet in a way that is super helpful for my clients right.
Speaker 1:Coming with solutions will help your supervisor, who you know what. They may be a level one supervisor they just may be not really great at supervising yet, and that's okay. Supervisor they just may be not really great at supervising yet, and that's okay. Everybody gets to be a beginner Just not okay for you right now. So approaching that person with solutions is going to help them grow Again, not your job and you will get a way forward through this. What do you think, jennifer?
Speaker 2:No, that I mean that, that I feel like that's even just counseling in general, if, if somebody comes to us and they're having some sort of relational issue, we tell them, like don't just tell the other person all the litany list of problems you have with them. Bring solutions to the table. People are more receptive when they think you care enough to try to address the issue. And so, yeah, no, I love it, bring solutions, because problems just stack up.
Speaker 1:Well, that's how your supervisor got there in the first place, right? If they're slapping you with a remediation plan and you thought everything was great and maybe even you know I'm going to go ahead and throw some things in from our previous episode If you were doing things for the supervisor that maybe crossed some boundaries, like you were writing policy and procedures, manuals for them, or you were helping them network with folks who could help them get grants, or you were, you know something beyond the scope of your job or clinical supervision, this could feel like a real hit upside the head, and so you approaching it this way is going to help move forward. But here's the big but Now practicing self-care and boundaries. When Jennifer and I were first talking about this, you know we come at boundaries as counselors in one way, but if your boundary has to be okay, I've got to. I'm going to stay in this supervision relationship, but I have to have a boundary. I mean Jennifer, I mean talk about that a little bit, you know, with your supervisor.
Speaker 2:Well, I think that I think everybody kind of jumps to the conclusion that a boundary is I'm drawing an imaginary fence in a box around me and if you cross, it all is going to break loose. But most of the time when we're dealing with people, we have to put boundaries in place where they're going to cross your little imaginary fence whether you like it or not. So you have to decide what are my boundaries? Ok, if one of my boundaries is is I really need supervision that is consistent and my supervisor is available, and then that supervisor doesn't meet that expectation. The boundary is is how am I going to address it? Am I just going to sit there and whine about it? Am I going to have that difficult conversation, or am I going to seek a new supervisor?
Speaker 2:So I like to use boundaries to empower people. As in, you don't have to deal with whatever it is somebody's doing. If you don't like that, every morning your husband opens and closes the door. You don't need to yell at him all the time about opening and closing the door. You just get to decide if you want to be married to him or not. And so it goes with supervision right, like if you don't mesh with your supervisor for whatever reason you're not married to them for life.
Speaker 1:You can find a new supervisor and you can. I mean, we've got all kinds of support. That's the other thing. I mean, if you're practicing in isolation, if you're in a rural area, perhaps, and you don't have a lot of resources around you, well, if you've got the internet, you can join Texas Counselors Creating Badass Businesses even if you're not in Texas, right, Tons of people who can help you network and find other resources supervisors. We have the new Facebook, which hopefully, as of this recording, it's not going to be that new. We've got from class to couch, which is just for connecting associates, pre-licensed folks, with supervisors, and we offer meet and greets. I mean, this is all free, we offer all kinds of things and it's a click away. So I want to empower, oh and the directory. We have the Kate Walker Training Supervisor Directory. They're all over Texas and I think 90% of them are virtual.
Speaker 1:So if you're in Texas, you do not have to be employed at the same location as your supervisor. Now, that's not to say your supervisor might not make that a condition for supervising, Supervisor might not make that a condition for supervising. And if that's the case, again, we got the badass group. In the Facebook group you say, OK, look, I need a job, I need other employment, I'm virtual counseling something out there. What I'm trying to say is that I hope I'm saying what Jennifer's saying, which is, you're not trapped If you have a boundary that your supervisor can't do this, this and this right. They can't just surprise me with a remediation plan. They can't just take three weeks off and not tell me. They can't just, you know, tell me.
Speaker 2:Charge me $300 a session.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, I almost forgot about that. That is so. I mean, we hear that all the time. Why am I paying $300 a week for supervision? If your boundary is being crossed, then you know red flag. But then you have to do something and I'm sorry, not sorry. It's up to you to either have the conversation or exit that relationship, or both. You know, hopefully both. We want you to have the conversation, but you're too important to lose because you got discouraged because of bad supervision. You went through all this school. You're paying money for supervision, probably, and you're seeing tons and tons and tons of clients because you're grinding out those hours. You want to get your full license and you're getting discouraged. No, we don't want that. You're too important to lose. Your community needs you. We have a mental health shortage in Texas and I know I'm sorry, not mental health shortage, mental health provider shortage. We do not have a mental health shortage.
Speaker 2:Got plenty of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so don't quit. You're too important to lose. So, no, don't quit. Listen to this podcast again, get connected into community and take your next steps. All right, we're here for you.
Speaker 2:I did. You reminded me of something that I just wanted to touch on. You know, we talk about these difficult conversations and a lot of associates are fresh out of grad school and you have these professors that hold all of the power right. You know they get to decide ultimately if your paper is great or not, you know. So you have all these people coming out of that dynamic back into a relationship where there's power, there's a power imbalance and and I think some associates probably there's just this fear that if I speak up, I'm going to lose, and it's it's like Oz pull back the curtain. They're people and a lot of them are going to listen, they're going to be receptive, they're going to be like, oh my gosh, absolutely, and it's not going to be this big, scary, difficult conversation. A lot of supervisors are incredibly receptive to listening and understanding and hearing you out, and so it may seem like it's going to be this horrible, difficult conversation, but a lot of times it's probably not.
Speaker 1:I am so glad you brought that up. Yeah, I mean, that's huge, right, because you do. You don't feel you can go against a professor, and so you carry that dynamic into the supervision relationship. And, yeah, most supervisors they want to do a good job, right, especially if they came from our training, right, they have the same philosophy we do. They want you to grow, they don't want you to quit, they want to do better. So, yes, that too. So go do good work, have the difficult conversation. You can do this and keep listening to this. Thanks for tuning in.
Speaker 2:Thank you, my voice cracked. Thank you, okay.