Badass Therapists Building Practices That Thrive

133 Licensure Portability for Supervisors: What You Need to Know

• Dr. Kate Walker Ph.D., LPC/LMFT Supervisor • Season 3 • Episode 133

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Speaker 1:

It's a huge misunderstanding. I've had licensed counselors who've been in the profession for 10, 15 years. I've had licensed professional counseling supervisors question me and literally look at me point blank and go how are you doing that?

Speaker 2:

Welcome to Badass Therapists, building practices that thrive, where it's all about working smarter, not harder.

Speaker 1:

Now here's your host, dr Kate Walker who's counting down the months until she has?

Speaker 2:

her first grandkid. If you're a supervisor, or planning to become one, this episode is a must listen. We're breaking down what happens when you want to supervise across state lines and the roadblocks and possibilities that come with it. And don't forget the Smart Practice Sprint. This virtual event starts June 2nd. Day one is totally free and it's all about helping you build a profitable, streamlined private practice. Sign up now at katewalkertrainingcom slash bonus and be sure to catch the mid-roll for more details. Now let's get to work.

Speaker 2:

Hey, I'm Dr Kate Walker and we are going to continue our conversation about Counseling Compact. What this is, it's a way to get rid of barriers so counselors can counsel their clients across state lines. So what does Texas have to say about counseling across state lines? It's where your client's feet are. Where your client's feet are, that's where counseling is happening. Not every state does that. Most states do.

Speaker 2:

And, of course, if you are doing an international thing and you're a digital nomad, you know, and you're in a country that doesn't have any counseling rules at all or doesn't even have the term counseling, that's really sort of a wild card right, because you would have to abide by the rules for that country. And so when we are in Texas and we're seeing a client and our client decides to go, let's say, to California. Well, you and Google counseling in California. What does California have to say about that? And it just so happens, as of this recording, california allows you to have a few sessions across state lines, for if I'm in another state and the client is in their state, so that's good if you have a client going to California, but not so much in other states. So I invited Jennifer to come on because she knows about this stuff too, and you are actually in it because you are a counselor in another state. So talk a little bit about that.

Speaker 1:

So I work out of the state of New Hampshire. New Hampshire is actually a part of the counseling compact. However, I cannot take advantage of that because New Hampshire is not my home state. So, because Texas isn't a part of the counseling compact, if I want to counsel in any state I have to get licensed in that state, regardless of whether or not they are a part of the counseling compact. It's interesting because there's a misconception that New Hampshire is one of the most difficult states as far as licensure rules and regulations go. But what I found is that Texas is a lot stricter and so getting licensed in another state is kind of a difficult process.

Speaker 1:

Utah, for example, they require 4,000 hours. So if you don't have 4,000 postgraduate hours, they require you to get that additional 1,000. And so that's why the counseling compact is so important, because it kind of keeps us from having to like jump through the hoops here, jump through the hoops there and get licensed in more states. But yeah, I can work in New Hampshire, but I can't work in any of the compact states through New Hampshire because it's not my home state.

Speaker 2:

That's interesting, because that wasn't one of the cons we even talked about last week. Right, and you get pushback sometimes because people don't understand. You can be in Texas and be a licensed New Hampshire counselor and see clients, while your feet are in Texas and the client's feet are in New Hampshire.

Speaker 1:

It's a huge misunderstanding. I've had licensed counselors who've been in the profession for 10, 15 years. I've had licensed professional counseling supervisors question me and literally look at me point blank and go how are you doing that? And I'm like, just think logically through this. I submitted an application with my address in Texas, I made it very clear where I reside and that board approved me. So it's not a legality question, but there's a lot of misconceptions because for so long we've been told that the client's feet have to be in Texas and it's like the telephone game Somehow that's now transitioned to everybody's feet have to be in Texas, no matter what.

Speaker 2:

And so I just kind of laugh and yeah, OK, and if you're, you know, if you stalk the threads, for you know the digital nomad groups, you know the traveling therapists and things like that Great groups In fact, if you, if you need to know the rules for other countries and other states, highly recommend that you join those groups. But with the Counseling Compact, it's not all roses either. I mean, one of the things we talked about last week was the idea that folks like me who never took the NCE I mean, I got licensed back when it was still a Texas license test right, it was just for Texas, built for Texas, made by Texas, whatever and one of the stipulations is 60 credit hours and passing the MCE and please, please, don't quote me. This could all change, right, this is just kind of what exists right now. It's not the NCMHCE, which is another exam that Texas accepts. So this idea that, okay, when the FOMPAC comes, it's all you know, kumbaya, and we're all going to be able to, just, you know, take our licenses, like our driver's licenses, and cross state lines everywhere and do our thing, maybe not, and there will be a process. Right, there's going to be a compact board, there's going to be a website where you actually apply and pay a fee and make sure that you do what you need to do to be an operational part of the compact and, as Jennifer said, right now Texas is not in it right.

Speaker 2:

This is our second round to try to get that passed, and it's a legislative issue, not a board issue. It's not a BHEK issue, it is a legislative issue, so all right. So I hope that catches everybody up. If not, go back to last week's episode and get more details. So let's talk about supervision. So, jennifer, can you supervise across state lines?

Speaker 1:

If you are licensed to supervise in that state.

Speaker 2:

Well, and that's that's part of this too, right Understanding that supervision is not counseling. Ok, so when you're supervising and your associate is in, let's say, new Hampshire, well, if your supervisee in New Hampshire is accruing hours for Texas and you are a Texas supervisor, well you can supervise them for those Texas hours.

Speaker 1:

But if they are licensed in New Hampshire and you're a Texas supervisor, your supervision isn't going to count for those New Hampshire hours. I mean, am I saying that right, jennifer? Yes, and that's there's a significant misunderstanding and you have to go back to logic. Okay, so if I go to grad school in Texas and then I get a Texas supervisor and I move to Maine, I don't need to start over, right, like I don't need to start over, right, like I don't need to start over. I could live in Maine and still see clients in Texas and that count towards my Texas licensure hours, just like I have in New Hampshire.

Speaker 1:

I'm under supervision in New Hampshire, right, because I'm seeking full licensure in New Hampshire. I also have a supervisor in Texas because I'm seeking full licensure in New Hampshire. I also have a supervisor in Texas because I'm seeking full licensure in Texas. As long as both supervisors meet the qualifications of that state, I can count those hours towards both license, regardless of where they're done. Because people forget people. We move, we go places, we do other things and there's this belief that I got my license in Texas and I moved to Maine and therefore my hours no longer count and it just all goes. Does that make sense? Yeah, did I answer your question right?

Speaker 2:

No, you're doing and it brings to mind you know, because I know where that belief comes from. Right, pre-covid, when we couldn't do virtual if you moved to Maine, you were kind of out of luck. Right, okay, I'm in Maine now because my partner's in the military or for whatever reason my partner's job. So I guess I just have to give up my associateship in Texas. Right, because the only people I can see are Mainers. Right? Well now, since your client's feet are in Texas, your body's in Maine, your clients are in Texas, you have a Texas supervisor. You can finish your Texas associate experience hours and become a Texas LPC, if that's what you still want to do. Right, if you want to become a Maine therapist, then you would have to find a Maine supervisor and make sure you pass and do all the things Maine wants you to do. Hey, badass listeners, quick pause. If you're tired of spinning your wheels and ready to grow a private practice that actually pays the bills, you need to check out my Smart Practice Sprint. This live, four-day virtual experience is designed to help you simplify your marketing structure a HIPAA-compliant business and book more clients fast. And the best part, day one is totally free. It starts June 2nd, so go to katewalkertrainingcom slash bonus to grab your spot. Now that's katewalkertrainingcom slash bonus, because it's time to stop guessing and start growing All right back to the show.

Speaker 2:

So two aspects of this are where the client's feet are right. That's where counseling is happening. But now this other aspect is where you want to be licensed. Right, If you want to be licensed in a particular state, you need to find a supervisor from that state, if that state even requires supervision. I mean, we still have states that don't require a supervisor, so we're kind of drifting away from the compact idea. Because supervision is specifically for licensure and so in Texas an associate cannot see clients unless they have a supervisor. So if the supervisor and the associate have a falling out and the associate fires their supervisor, the associate cannot see clients until they have another supervisor for those Texas hours. So yes, the supervisor is necessary for those experience hours toward licensure.

Speaker 1:

One of the things that I from my understanding just because I read a lot about the compact, because it does apply to a state that I'm licensed in that the compact does not allow associates or provisional licenses or candidacy licenses, whatever the state calls it. They do not allow them to operate under the compact. So my supervisor in New Hampshire would be covered under the compact and she could see people in Connecticut, but that doesn't mean that I can also see people in Connecticut. You have to be fully licensed and I think that's the other misconception. When it comes to supervision and I have seen a question in an associate group, they were, like my supervisor, my state's part of the counseling compact and because my supervisor said I'm operating under their license, I can see clients in any state.

Speaker 2:

That's right. I remember that question. That is untrue. I think we need to say that again because let's say both parts of it. So, first of all, associates the compact isn't going to help you at all, associates and I'm looking at that. You know you have to have a master's degree check, 60 credit hours, check, passing the NCE check, check, check, clean disciplinary record. But you have to have an unencumbered independent license to be able to take advantage of the compact. Now, that was part one. I'm glad you clarified that. Part two is that weird misconception we ran across and say that again. I think we need to make sure that people understand this.

Speaker 1:

So it was an associate asking the question. Their home state is a compact state and their supervisor told them that they could see clients in any state part of the compact because they were operating under the supervisor's license. The supervisor made it sound like to the associate that, like the associate doesn't have their own license, their license is. The supervisor made it sound like to the associate that, like the associate doesn't have their own license, their license is the supervisor's license and therefore they have all the leniency qualifications, whatever that they hold. And the associate was like I pushed back because they keep assigning me clients in other states and I don't think I can see them. Do I need to find a new supervisor? Because there was, you know, misunderstandings.

Speaker 2:

Yes, because that is absolutely, unequivocally untrue, because we don't know. I mean, all Jennifer and I know are supervision rules in Texas. So in Texas an LPC associate can do anything their supervisor can do. Lmft associate can do anything their supervisor can do with the supervisor's permission. If the supervisor says, yes, go do hypnotherapy, it's absolutely okay, then there's nothing prohibiting that associate from doing that. But that's not the same thing as having all the rights and privileges that that independently licensed supervisor has. So if your supervisor is part of the compact and they can do therapy anywhere, any state in the compact, yay, you associate. Cannot that clear? That clear, right? I'm just thinking of people who are going to bump into this podcast episode and be like that one little section where you're describing it, it's like no, no, no, no, you can't do that. All right. So compact and supervision it's kind of a weird. It really the compact doesn't affect supervision, right? If you're going to supervise your Texas supervisee in a different state, that's okay if they are accruing hours for clients located in Texas. So I hope that makes sense. So thank you, jennifer, for coming on and talking about that. Absolutely, all right, see you later. Thanks for listening. If today's episode got you fired up to finally build the private practice you've been dreaming about.

Speaker 2:

Don't miss the Smart Practice Sprint. It's happening virtually, so you can join from anywhere, your HIPAA compliance dialed in and your client calendar. Moving from crickets to booked Head to katewalkertrainingcom. Slash bonus to register, remember, night one is completely free. And here's the exciting part. I'll be taking this sprint on the road in Texas. Soon I'm going to be coming to DFW, austin, houston, el Paso so wherever you are, I'll be coming to a city near you. Can't wait to see you inside the Sprint and maybe shake your hand in person real soon. I'm Dr Kate Walker. Thank you so much for listening. I'm Dr Kate Walker. Thank you so much for listening. Thank you to the lovely Ridgely Walker for the interesting facts about me that we use in our introduction and do me a favor when you get a second, please like, share and subscribe and write us a review. That's really how we get picked up by other RSS feeds and we get this information out to the mental health badasses who need it. Thanks again, and keep saving the world with excellent therapy. You.